Building two Identical 3-string CBGs at once...... Both have the same buzzing problem....... ARGGGGGGGGGG!

I am in the process of building two identical guitars at the same time (3-stringers and FRETLESS). I figured at least one would turn out for me. Actually both of them being identical look decent and the process went pretty good. I am now at the stage of stringing and tuning them. They both have the same problem and that is that they both strum nice and clean at the open chord but when I fret anywhere on the fretboard they buzz horribly (a twangy buzz not a rattle). NOT A LITTLE... A LOT. I do play the guitar so I know a little about where to look for buzzes. This buzz is huge. The three tuners are new and tight. None of the strings are anywhere close to the fretboard anywhere. I can raise the nut and the saddle so high that I can't play it and it still buzzes when I fret. My novice thinking is that the buzzing must have to do with the box itself. I purchased both boxes from a hobby store and they feel really solid but have the usually two clasps and two hinges on the opposite side. On each corner of the box is an ornamental piece of thin metal that is tacked down. I originally thought that they might be rattling but when I lacquered the final finish I pretty much cemented them down so they aren't moving.. I don't think. The other area that I thought might be making the buzzing is that I glued a 1/4" strip of red cedar (fretboard) onto the neck which is 1" x 2" red cedar and that all seems fine but I cut the 1/4" fretboard right at the junction of the body and the neck. In other words, the fretboard does not overlap onto the body. I don't know if this gap area could cause buzzing..... So a long story short.... Does extreme buzzing at every fret sound like a common mistake in building a CBG that a beginner like myself would make? Bad boxes? Maybe fretless CBGs buzz all the time?? Tried tons of strings of all different sizes and gauges. Tried all different nut and saddle heights. It plays fantastic at open chord.... just don't fret it or it buzzes.... It's a twangy buzz, if that means anything

Any common mistakes that new builders run into when they build their first one (or two) that usually creates lots of buzzing? Any thoughts good or bad appreciate. Looks like I might some good firewood for this upcoming winter

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LADIES AND GENTLEMEN....... WE HAVE A WINNER....... PLEASE HOLD ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS UNTIL IT HAS BEEN VERIFIED!

It appears that the problem has been solved. ANSWER: The bridge height was too low in relation to the nut height. From looking at the strings from the sides it looked like all the strings were way above the fretboard and when strumming I could not see any touching of the strings to the fretboard yet it buzzed. I tried many nut and bridge combinations. Finally when I put in a much HIGHER bridge than I would have expected (still playable of course) the buzzing completely stopped.... YAHOOOOOOOOOOO!

I think many of you may have eluded to this relationship in one form or another over the course of this thread, and I thank all of you guys. The two special STARS that finally got thru to me about this potential problem area were MUNGO PARK and aka MATT. Special thanks to you guys. My only regret in all of this is that I am somewhat sorry that I had to drag this thread out because I probably should have figured it out myself. Oh well, maybe I can help someone out down the road.

TO ONE AND ALL I THANK YOU SO MUCH...... AND FREE BEER COMPLIMENTS OF MUNGO PARK AND MATT!

Replies

Mark June 10, 2011 at 2:06pm

Nah, the problem was as described by Huntz Meyer.
Brian "Pork Pie" Anderson June 9, 2011 at 4:15pm

to me it looks like the box lid to the box is where your issue is, those box clasps are not tight enough IMO to keep the box lid tight against the bottom, this is based on my past experience, your box may be diff. if you could clamp the lid/box with two small clamps and try to strum it that will determine for sure
molinee May 27, 2011 at 10:22pm

AND WE ALL LIVED HAPPILY EVER AFTER!

THE END!
Huntz Meyer May 27, 2011 at 1:09pm

I'll agree and disagree with Matt. The drawing he shows will buzz, not because of the back angle, but because of the 'negative' angle between string and fretboard. Drop the nut, and/or raise the bridge and a backangle works fine - just make sure the string has a positive angle with the fretboard. More gap at 12th fret than at 1st fret. Extreme example shown.
MichaelS Country Boy Guitars May 27, 2011 at 12:38pm

Glad you got it worked out. Raising the bridge will compensate for buzz's on the neck if it has them, also too low a bridge can lay the strings flat on the neck (as Matts picture implies) and it sounds like that is what you had going. Once you get the bridge were you like it you can lower the nut really low on a fretless, almost touching. I have some of mine set so I can stick a medium pick under it and it stays, the low nut makes fretting nice, especially with a high bridge.
Uncle John May 27, 2011 at 8:23am

I found this post after you had fixed your problem. Good for you. Super interesting and some really good questions and suggestions. I have to say Artist/Matt's impressed me most. Very cool how the nation tried to help.

ED and Erics recommendations to set it aside for a while was also good. I have to to this some times.

I have 2 problem guitars set aside right now. One is a neck angle (flatting out) problem that Matt helped make clear to me. And the other one I just don't know. It has great volume, but a light buzz and a tone that just annoys me. Pretty little git. I will fix or junk #1 and set the other aside a while longer.
Uncle John May 27, 2011 at 8:09am

HOLY CRAP!!!! That is exactly my problem with the Roi Tan box I made recently. I have it set aside to try and change to a flatter angle and if that fails, junk it out. Thanks!

Artist Formerly Known as Matt said:

Here's what I mean. See how the neck is slanted below the box? It shouldn't be. It should be even or slanted up slightly.

You can see where the red string is closer to the fretboard at the box /neck junction. Guaranteed to buzz IF this is the problem.

AFKAM
Mungo Park May 26, 2011 at 9:19pm

Thanks man, and I will go have that beer now, always good to use the grey matter, with out you, it would have just jelled.

Cheers Ron.
Outhouse Instruments May 26, 2011 at 5:56pm

No applause please.

lol

Matt - glad i could help

molinee said:

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN....... WE HAVE A WINNER....... PLEASE HOLD ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS UNTIL IT HAS BEEN VERIFIED!

The two special STARS that finally got thru to me about this potential problem area were MUNGO PARK and aka MATT. Special thanks to you guys.

TO ONE AND ALL I THANK YOU SO MUCH...... AND FREE BEER COMPLIMENTS OF MUNGO PARK AND MATT!
molinee May 26, 2011 at 5:38pm

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN....... WE HAVE A WINNER....... PLEASE HOLD ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS UNTIL IT HAS BEEN VERIFIED!

It appears that the problem has been solved. ANSWER: The bridge height was too low in relation to the nut height. From looking at the strings from the sides it looked like all the strings were way above the fretboard and when strumming I could not see any touching of the strings to the fretboard yet it buzzed.  I tried many nut and bridge combinations. Finally when I put in a much HIGHER bridge than I would have expected (still playable of course) the buzzing completely stopped.... YAHOOOOOOOOOOO!

I think many of you may have eluded to this relationship in one form or another over the course of this thread, and I thank all of you guys. The two special STARS that finally got thru to me about this potential problem area were MUNGO PARK and aka MATT. Special thanks to you guys.  My only regret in all of this is that I am somewhat sorry that I had to drag this thread out because I probably should have figured it out myself. Oh well, maybe I can help someone out down the road.

              TO ONE AND ALL I THANK YOU SO MUCH...... AND FREE BEER COMPLIMENTS OF MUNGO PARK AND MATT!

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