Any body have a clue why I get this loud squealing feedback through the amp when I try to turn up the volume? It is not corrected by moving further from the amp. This is a piezo pickup mounted to the underside of the lid.
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On my first cb guitar I mounted 4 piezos under the soundboard still in their plastic casings. These were fitted with both a layer of Lidl repair glue and 2 screws in each using the casing holes (2 per piezo). I get massive feedback with this guitar similar to that which others are reporting.
Somewhere on this site there is a video about using a capacitor in parallel to reduce, but not eliminate, feedback.
My first guitar is well sealed-up so I can't easily get into it to try a capacitor but I certainly will deploy one in my next project...and on this occassion I will just glue the piezos (out of their cases) under the soundboard...This time I plan to use 2.
I made an instrument called a feedbackophone. It needed an open space from the mic to the speaker in order to work. When my friend's CBG fedback a lot, I assumed it was because it had a massive soundhole on the front. I made my first CBG with no sound hole and it still projects pretty well acousticly, but the real difference seems to be that there is a lot less feedback when it is plugged in and turned on.
Piezoelectric transducers seem inherently "tinney". I have used a capacitor across between + and - wires. the one I tried is called an "Orange Drop". It it like turning the treble way down. The bridge seems to be a good choice(as opposed to a "top"). It might be cool for some, to use a neck or even peg-head placement.(gets fret/left hand percussion). A blend knob could be used. I don't know much about capacitors, just salvaged a bunch and test. I sort in three piles, 1. no effect, 2. no sound, 3. tonal modification. Some of my experiments with phonograph cartridges has been profitable. There again they use a tone modification. I took one out of the turntable. I think I will soon use a whole tone arm, just for the "look"of it.
Wrap your peizo in a hanky inside of the guitar. Now the peizo floats in there and it is not touching anything, but it also picks up the sound too as well. It does give the box a deeper tone as well.
Damn Sven thats all too technical for me, but it was an 8 in. sq. box
Sven Pfitt said:
One possibility is you may have a resonant enclosure problem.
For instance the RS 273-0073 is spec'd to have a resonance of 2500+/-500Hz. The center frequency of 2500hz has a wavelength of 1100f/s / 2500/s =0.44ft = 5.28". The range is 2000Hz to 3000Hz, so the range of sizes can go from 4.4" to 6.6" .
If this piezo transducer is placed in the center of a 5.28" wide box there is a strong probability it will squeal at 2500Hz if it gets enough feedback from the amp.
The solution is to move it off center. This has the unfortunate side effect of changing the tonal response.
One possibility is you may have a resonant enclosure problem.
For instance the RS 273-0073 is spec'd to have a resonance of 2500+/-500Hz. The center frequency of 2500hz has a wavelength of 1100f/s / 2500/s =0.44ft = 5.28". The range is 2000Hz to 3000Hz, so the range of sizes can go from 4.4" to 6.6" .
If this piezo transducer is placed in the center of a 5.28" wide box there is a strong probability it will squeal at 2500Hz if it gets enough feedback from the amp.
The solution is to move it off center. This has the unfortunate side effect of changing the tonal response.
Generally, you want really good mechanical connection to the strings (i.e., the bridge saddle) and as little connection to the box as possible. That will minimize feedback. So direct contact with the bridge and foam separating it from the box.
As a practical matter, piezos naturally have some brittle high freq stuff that's hard to control down the line. It helps to put something that mechanically absorbs high freq between the piezo and the bridge. (I use a rubbery, space filling, jewelry glue so there's a layer of the glue to mechanically insulate the piezo.)
Wiring two piezos in series will also help tame the high freq.
After trying everything, what I actually do most of the time is use 1 piezo, glued with a blob of jewelry glue, inside the box right under the treble foot of the bridge. No need for foam since the air in the box actually insulates the piezo from any extraneous movement in the box (piezo's don't pick up air movement very well). No feedback problems at the moderate amp settings I use on stage. They would feedback in front of a stack turned up to 11 - If I played that way, I would fill the box with foam to prevent it vibrating at all and build the piezo into the bridge ... or just use an electromagnetic pickup.
RandyRoosterGuitars said:
As a newbie, can someone explain the do's and dont's of piezo encasement? I cant quite figure if the whole thing is completely encased in contact with its 'encaser' (probably not the correct terminology lol) , or if the piezo should sit in a cavity so its encased, but with nothing touching the face?
As a newbie, can someone explain the do's and dont's of piezo encasement? I cant quite figure if the whole thing is completely encased in contact with its 'encaser' (probably not the correct terminology lol) , or if the piezo should sit in a cavity so its encased, but with nothing touching the face?
Replies
Hi all
For what it's worth....
On my first cb guitar I mounted 4 piezos under the soundboard still in their plastic casings. These were fitted with both a layer of Lidl repair glue and 2 screws in each using the casing holes (2 per piezo). I get massive feedback with this guitar similar to that which others are reporting.
Somewhere on this site there is a video about using a capacitor in parallel to reduce, but not eliminate, feedback.
My first guitar is well sealed-up so I can't easily get into it to try a capacitor but I certainly will deploy one in my next project...and on this occassion I will just glue the piezos (out of their cases) under the soundboard...This time I plan to use 2.
Cheers.....Bernie
Sven Pfitt said:
For instance the RS 273-0073 is spec'd to have a resonance of 2500+/-500Hz. The center frequency of 2500hz has a wavelength of 1100f/s / 2500/s =0.44ft = 5.28". The range is 2000Hz to 3000Hz, so the range of sizes can go from 4.4" to 6.6" .
If this piezo transducer is placed in the center of a 5.28" wide box there is a strong probability it will squeal at 2500Hz if it gets enough feedback from the amp.
The solution is to move it off center. This has the unfortunate side effect of changing the tonal response.
What is the size of your cigar box?
Sven.
As a practical matter, piezos naturally have some brittle high freq stuff that's hard to control down the line. It helps to put something that mechanically absorbs high freq between the piezo and the bridge. (I use a rubbery, space filling, jewelry glue so there's a layer of the glue to mechanically insulate the piezo.)
Wiring two piezos in series will also help tame the high freq.
After trying everything, what I actually do most of the time is use 1 piezo, glued with a blob of jewelry glue, inside the box right under the treble foot of the bridge. No need for foam since the air in the box actually insulates the piezo from any extraneous movement in the box (piezo's don't pick up air movement very well). No feedback problems at the moderate amp settings I use on stage. They would feedback in front of a stack turned up to 11 - If I played that way, I would fill the box with foam to prevent it vibrating at all and build the piezo into the bridge ... or just use an electromagnetic pickup.
RandyRoosterGuitars said:
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