Posted by Cory Swartz on February 4, 2011 at 7:26pm
Howdy y'all. I'm Cory and got turned onto this site last week by a couple friends. I built my first cbg this past week with mostly stuff from a hobby store. Its just a one stringer but was real fun to put together and even more fun to plunk around with. I played bass up until a few years ago when a hand injury got to be real painful to deal with but recently thought I might be able to make some noise with one of these just to keep my mind and hands working and try something different. not much of a great musician but really enjoy music and making things. a 3 string is next and then I would really like to put an old humidor and a box from some bicycle frame tools to use in some kind of bass type instrument. I'll try to add some pics of the one string in a bit...
everyone has a 'gotta do' list -- of course when doing a balanced acoustic guitar or mando --- sure you want the 'top to vibrate freely' but damn, this is a stick glued to a box...I swear more people build these with the top glued tight to the neck...that's the standard plan --- these quickie three and four stringers necks are likely not supported with truss rods and unless you brace the top of the box...i think we're asking for trouble with iffy tip to toe stiffness (or lack thereof) -- one of the things that make these ring so full and true I think is the solidness from bridge to nut... neck through guitars are often hailed as sustaining better... I'd want to make sure my top was stiff and thick enough (or braced enough) to handle the down-pressure of the bridge when strung to tension --
you don't need to notch anything to mount the piezo --- just stick it to the neck inside the box (on the underside of the neck, obviously) --- not that mine is the be all end all, but my first one came out seriously a fully usable instrument. intonates perfectly, stays in tune forever, rings loud and proud even WITHOUT a front sound hole -- And I basically follwed Shane's directions, but I added a few support blocks and stuff that made engineering sense to me...so I can screw the box shut tight and still get inside it in the future...
if you don't know what I mean about the build I'm talking about, take a galnce at my 'CBG1 prototype' Michael's box...there are process shots of how I constructed it...the neck glued right to the top, the piezo stuck to the neck) --- go for whatever is feeling right to you.... just don't make so many nothches and tricky little things --- more chances for something to get weird or bow over time or just take sustain from the strings...
if you just strung up a board and nailed a tin can to the board near the bridge you'd get a pretty killer sound
eh, it's all a blast --- I want to see what you end up going with for your 'method' -- talk soon, ET
wow that's great info! thanks for the fast response!
I got a 3 string kit and in the instructions it said something about making sure the top of box could vibrate freely... that's where I was getting that, and some info from a local guitar shop. but when I look back at what the guitar guy said I still had this biting feeling in my gut that he was trying to sell something and get me to spend money on something I didn't want but he wanted to sell...
yeah, the scale I have is way long, wouldn't recommend it but so far is workin for me.
I'm thinkin the piezo's coming will be about the same size as you have. once it comes in I'm off to micheals again to see what happens.
got 2 plans for that, 1) puttin' the wires in to see if I can get sound out of an old pig-nose amp and 2) make one of these for a buddy's 4 year old(scale will be reduced of course and not electric) gotta size his finger for a slide...
machinist by trade but still that will be a trick, find the right scrap, bore to size that can "grow with him"...
next go round will get the neck more flush, right now it just touches but inside the box its not notched for the box-top let alone a piezo but that will be in the plans...
it(neck) is "screwed"or rather nailed w/ brass tacks and glued to the top so its in contact but maybe not at optimum resonance transferal... but then it still sounds and I dig it, so maybe that's the most important thing for anybody doing their own...
I remember a line from BB King, "it dont matter if she weighs 76 lbs soakin wet or three hundred fi'ty pounds on-feet, if she's yo' lady and you love her, then she's yo' pretty lil thing..."
I think that's the cool thing about all the home-made, cigar box, what-have-you instruments.
there's a bit of mechanics, physics, electronics, music theory, ect but in the end its all really "theory"... its really about getting the sound "you" want and beyond that its the beholder...
if "she's yo' pretty lil' thing"...?
I like to hear about "pretty lil' things" and how folks get theirs to sing.. :)
my Radio Shack piezo (273?) is about the size of a quarter, it's funny, the thing can be a nightmare with one or two pingy frequencies if you don't take the time to dial in (or out) the tone -- but with a little gooring around I think I found some very usable settings -- I plug straight into my Blues Junior and turn the Bass, Mid, & Tre all the way down to 2 or 3 depending...sometimes I go through a tube screamer (that needs tweaking too, but I have a sweet spot that's great now -- but mostly either I run dry or through a chorus and a boss verb/echo unit...
Not sure what you mean about 'don't screw and glue the neck to the top.' Mine is glued flush (with piezo mounted to the neck under and in front of the bridge two inches -- and it sings and rings llike a piano (open strummed anyway) absolutely you can glue it to the top...then it's a solid unit end to end, with the bridge solid to the neck and top and each side of the top is its own 'half-sized' soundboard getting info from the neck-through and bridge -- if the whole top floats i think you'll end up with some pretty wild howling -- maybe not. the tops on the Michael's basswood boxes are way too thin and soft to handle down pressure from the bridge -- the top would warp and or crack eventually -- I can imagine maybe cutting a notch in the neck under where the bridge sits...could be cool to transfer the vibration to the top soundboard but still have it tamed and tight and supported closely by the neck wood
SCALE-- if 27 is feeling good to your hands, maybe that's cool like a baritone. or maybe split the diff. 26.25" -- I love that there are rules, but that they can be tweaked -- I have trouble playing 24.75 length because my muscle memory seems trained to 25.5 -- I play a Gibson and I feel like it's a student guitar-scale somehow. So I'm gonna keep my CBGs 25.5 unless it's a weird build on purpose.
I have some new piezos that are smaller and some in weird casings I may or not break open...I have a big one one the way -- who knows how these might sound. maybe small ones will be more realistic? or big ones more powerful? maybe a big one mounted to the neck and a small one mounted to the back soundboard? if I were rich I know I'd have a CBG research lab in my basement...
I been noticing that resonance thing w/ the back you mention, big time!
I sit in front of the tv and tweak and twonk away tryin to play stuff and notice it alot.
I think the ball thingy helps relocate in a sitting position in front of tv or computer or the chair in my garage, whereever... that was the other "unknown" goodness of doing it that way.I have another knubby thing I wanted to add at the top of the neck but I kinda like it squared off. but have been thinkin about revisions to this design before I move to the doin a 3 stringer. #1 don't screw the pooch and nail and glue the neck to the top!
I did unknowingly cutting some of the resonance. nothing a heat gun and nail puller can't fix but then another $10 at the craft store for new box and neck, as well.
#2, put piezo pickup in the sucker. got a kit coming and my pignose has been sitting idle for so long...
#3 redo how the bridge and nut are done... pics would tell a better story but mainly reduce the size to lower the action a little.
#4 maybe, and a big maybe at that... reduce the size of the scale. its like 27+ inches but I kinda like it like that. gives room for my big gangly fingers to noodle around:)
what size piezo did you use? interested to know how it picks up volume/tone ect.
20mm on the way for v2 but always interested in learning more...
Thanks for the comments and compliment on the ball!
hey --- that looks cool as hell with the big ball! We definitely used the same box from Michael's --- basswood, with finger-joint corners -- I went with a 'aged'worn-burst' approach to the stain --- but man that box is so resonant -- the light basswood top and back are like drum heads on mine. and what's kinda cool, is if you hold the back of teh box against your body the thing projects like an acoustic --- but if you pull teh box away from you body so the back vibrates free, it sounds super woody ,like a banjo...mine is just a piezo straight to a 1/4" jack with no controls -- but I've changed the body position while playing to make it almost like changing a tone knob or pickup selector...
thanks Eric and David! I just added the pics. funny it WAS a $5 box from "Michael's", a pc of 1" dowel and a wooden ball to hold the butt-end of the string... I already changed the bridge to a pc of 3/4 long 3/8 dia brass from work and am going to do something different w/ the nut which is non-existent in the pics but will soon be when I get diggin thru some scrap from work. can't make the dog howl yet but that day will soon turn!
go for it, man...I bet you'll absolutely find a 'next level' facility and invent techniques goofing around with your one-stringer -- and especially when you get your 3-stringer...I SWEAR my regular guitar playing has been given a huge weird kind of technical and feel boost from my starting to 'master' some picking and slide techniques I've lucked into on my first 3-string CBG...interesting dynamic: play a cheapo fretless stick glued to a $5 box from a crafts store and become a better musician...good lesson there for all the arts I suppose...so go for your bass contraptions too...please post pics when you get them done... best of luck. E
Replies
everyone has a 'gotta do' list -- of course when doing a balanced acoustic guitar or mando --- sure you want the 'top to vibrate freely' but damn, this is a stick glued to a box...I swear more people build these with the top glued tight to the neck...that's the standard plan --- these quickie three and four stringers necks are likely not supported with truss rods and unless you brace the top of the box...i think we're asking for trouble with iffy tip to toe stiffness (or lack thereof) -- one of the things that make these ring so full and true I think is the solidness from bridge to nut... neck through guitars are often hailed as sustaining better... I'd want to make sure my top was stiff and thick enough (or braced enough) to handle the down-pressure of the bridge when strung to tension --
you don't need to notch anything to mount the piezo --- just stick it to the neck inside the box (on the underside of the neck, obviously) --- not that mine is the be all end all, but my first one came out seriously a fully usable instrument. intonates perfectly, stays in tune forever, rings loud and proud even WITHOUT a front sound hole -- And I basically follwed Shane's directions, but I added a few support blocks and stuff that made engineering sense to me...so I can screw the box shut tight and still get inside it in the future...
if you don't know what I mean about the build I'm talking about, take a galnce at my 'CBG1 prototype' Michael's box...there are process shots of how I constructed it...the neck glued right to the top, the piezo stuck to the neck) --- go for whatever is feeling right to you.... just don't make so many nothches and tricky little things --- more chances for something to get weird or bow over time or just take sustain from the strings...
if you just strung up a board and nailed a tin can to the board near the bridge you'd get a pretty killer sound
eh, it's all a blast --- I want to see what you end up going with for your 'method' -- talk soon, ET
E.
wow that's great info! thanks for the fast response!
I got a 3 string kit and in the instructions it said something about making sure the top of box could vibrate freely... that's where I was getting that, and some info from a local guitar shop. but when I look back at what the guitar guy said I still had this biting feeling in my gut that he was trying to sell something and get me to spend money on something I didn't want but he wanted to sell...
yeah, the scale I have is way long, wouldn't recommend it but so far is workin for me.
I'm thinkin the piezo's coming will be about the same size as you have. once it comes in I'm off to micheals again to see what happens.
got 2 plans for that, 1) puttin' the wires in to see if I can get sound out of an old pig-nose amp and 2) make one of these for a buddy's 4 year old(scale will be reduced of course and not electric) gotta size his finger for a slide...
machinist by trade but still that will be a trick, find the right scrap, bore to size that can "grow with him"...
next go round will get the neck more flush, right now it just touches but inside the box its not notched for the box-top let alone a piezo but that will be in the plans...
it(neck) is "screwed"or rather nailed w/ brass tacks and glued to the top so its in contact but maybe not at optimum resonance transferal... but then it still sounds and I dig it, so maybe that's the most important thing for anybody doing their own...
I remember a line from BB King, "it dont matter if she weighs 76 lbs soakin wet or three hundred fi'ty pounds on-feet, if she's yo' lady and you love her, then she's yo' pretty lil thing..."
I think that's the cool thing about all the home-made, cigar box, what-have-you instruments.
there's a bit of mechanics, physics, electronics, music theory, ect but in the end its all really "theory"... its really about getting the sound "you" want and beyond that its the beholder...
if "she's yo' pretty lil' thing"...?
I like to hear about "pretty lil' things" and how folks get theirs to sing.. :)
Many thanks again, for sharing!
my Radio Shack piezo (273?) is about the size of a quarter, it's funny, the thing can be a nightmare with one or two pingy frequencies if you don't take the time to dial in (or out) the tone -- but with a little gooring around I think I found some very usable settings -- I plug straight into my Blues Junior and turn the Bass, Mid, & Tre all the way down to 2 or 3 depending...sometimes I go through a tube screamer (that needs tweaking too, but I have a sweet spot that's great now -- but mostly either I run dry or through a chorus and a boss verb/echo unit...
Not sure what you mean about 'don't screw and glue the neck to the top.' Mine is glued flush (with piezo mounted to the neck under and in front of the bridge two inches -- and it sings and rings llike a piano (open strummed anyway) absolutely you can glue it to the top...then it's a solid unit end to end, with the bridge solid to the neck and top and each side of the top is its own 'half-sized' soundboard getting info from the neck-through and bridge -- if the whole top floats i think you'll end up with some pretty wild howling -- maybe not. the tops on the Michael's basswood boxes are way too thin and soft to handle down pressure from the bridge -- the top would warp and or crack eventually -- I can imagine maybe cutting a notch in the neck under where the bridge sits...could be cool to transfer the vibration to the top soundboard but still have it tamed and tight and supported closely by the neck wood
SCALE-- if 27 is feeling good to your hands, maybe that's cool like a baritone. or maybe split the diff. 26.25" -- I love that there are rules, but that they can be tweaked -- I have trouble playing 24.75 length because my muscle memory seems trained to 25.5 -- I play a Gibson and I feel like it's a student guitar-scale somehow. So I'm gonna keep my CBGs 25.5 unless it's a weird build on purpose.
I have some new piezos that are smaller and some in weird casings I may or not break open...I have a big one one the way -- who knows how these might sound. maybe small ones will be more realistic? or big ones more powerful? maybe a big one mounted to the neck and a small one mounted to the back soundboard? if I were rich I know I'd have a CBG research lab in my basement...
will report all findings. peace, E
Eric,
I been noticing that resonance thing w/ the back you mention, big time!
I sit in front of the tv and tweak and twonk away tryin to play stuff and notice it alot.
I think the ball thingy helps relocate in a sitting position in front of tv or computer or the chair in my garage, whereever... that was the other "unknown" goodness of doing it that way.I have another knubby thing I wanted to add at the top of the neck but I kinda like it squared off. but have been thinkin about revisions to this design before I move to the doin a 3 stringer. #1 don't screw the pooch and nail and glue the neck to the top!
I did unknowingly cutting some of the resonance. nothing a heat gun and nail puller can't fix but then another $10 at the craft store for new box and neck, as well.
#2, put piezo pickup in the sucker. got a kit coming and my pignose has been sitting idle for so long...
#3 redo how the bridge and nut are done... pics would tell a better story but mainly reduce the size to lower the action a little.
#4 maybe, and a big maybe at that... reduce the size of the scale. its like 27+ inches but I kinda like it like that. gives room for my big gangly fingers to noodle around:)
what size piezo did you use? interested to know how it picks up volume/tone ect.
20mm on the way for v2 but always interested in learning more...
Thanks for the comments and compliment on the ball!
thanks Eric and David! I just added the pics. funny it WAS a $5 box from "Michael's", a pc of 1" dowel and a wooden ball to hold the butt-end of the string... I already changed the bridge to a pc of 3/4 long 3/8 dia brass from work and am going to do something different w/ the nut which is non-existent in the pics but will soon be when I get diggin thru some scrap from work. can't make the dog howl yet but that day will soon turn!
I'll update stuff as I go... Thanks again guys!