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CB Mando, Mandola, Octave Mando, Tenor Guitar, Guitar - What Should I Get?

Posted by Barry Lampke on August 10, 2010 at 9:15pm in Building Secrets, Tips, Advice, Discussion
I'm new to CBGs and a bit clueless about what to get - and not sure if it matters exactly what it's called.

Ronnie sent me a video of his 4-string CBG tuned GDAE, but down an octave from mando tuning.  I like the sound - and it would be nice to have a second instrument that sounded different from my mando. 

Because it is a challenge to find what I want (cigar box octave mando? 
mandola?), I'm in touch with different folks about making a CB mando.

I would love something I can tune an octave down from my mando, but I'm
concerned about the chords being too much of a stretch if the frets are
wider.  Is the scale a factor in tuning an octave down?  Can I just find a mando with a longer neck?

Anyone know of any examples for sale that would meet these needs?  It seems like there are mostly 4-string 25" CBGs, CB ukes, and dulcimers -
and not many mandos (and no instruments like octave mandos or mandolas).

Thanks

Barry

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Replies

  • Barry Lampke August 15, 2010 at 12:45pm
    I am planning on using a Rocky Ford paper-covered wood box and 20" scale, so the string gauges you list below are helpful! What values did you put into the calculator to get these? If the .040 is too big, what would you recommend as a lighter alternative?

    Last, where do I get single strings like these? Will they have loops like mando strings or those metal balls on the ends like guitar strings? That will determine the tailpiece, right?

    Thanks!

    Barry

    String gauge calculator says for single string GDAE tuning for 20" (which now is more like a tenor guitar because of the single strings):

    G .040
    D .026
    A .018
    E .012

    That .040 is a bit large for an acoustic CB instrument, but if you can find a big, deep box you'll get the most of the bass.
  • Don Thompson August 11, 2010 at 7:39am
    Not a cigar box, but it shows how one has to use thicker strings for shorter scales, this was a set of the heaviest electrics I could find locally in Mexico. I suggested to the buyer he even go heavier than than the .011s.

    2139022500_5d2815b906_z.jpg

  • Barry Lampke August 10, 2010 at 11:20pm
    I think I need to find an octave mandolin to play. If I am good with the chords/fret spacing, then I can search for/order the appropriate instrument.

    Thanks, all!
  • Diane in Chicago August 10, 2010 at 11:01pm
    I don't think that will work to just retune a standard mandolin, because the strings you need to get an octave lower, but the same scale length, will be really, really fat. Or really floppy. Or both.

    But by adding several inches to the scale, you can get to octave mando tuning. "Real" octave mandolins are about 20", but you can squeeze down to 19". Even at 20 inches, that's a playable instrument for small/inflexible hands, and certainly much more playable that 24 or 25 or 26. IMHO!

    String gauge calculator says for single string GDAE tuning for 20" (which now is more like a tenor guitar because of the single strings):

    G .040
    D .026
    A .018
    E .012

    That .040 is a bit large for an acoustic CB instrument, but if you can find a big, deep box you'll get the most of the bass.

    And of course you can easily double the strings, or octave the strings, but with all that tension from 8 strings be sure to include a truss rod.

    Maybe you can go to a local music shop and play something - anything - that is 20" so you can see how it feels. Then you will know if that is a manageable size for your hands.
  • Ben August 10, 2010 at 10:52pm
    My vote goes for a tenor guitar or a mandola. They are each CGDA so you can use the same chord shapes as your mandolin, you'll just have to do a bit of transposing. Not a big deal...its good for you. I find that these two instruments offer a unique voice that adds a lot to a group of instruments. I just built a new tenor guitar for myself...23" scale. And no, don't tune your mandolin down an octave. Your instrument works so well because of tension. If you tune it down you lose all of the tension (and volume, tone, etc.) If you found thicker strings, you could play a mandolin an octave down and still keep the tension up. Too much trouble if you ask me.
  • Barry Lampke August 10, 2010 at 10:29pm
    Sorry - I am all over the map. I have a mandolin so I would like something different, but the same tuning - GDAE. I like the sound of Ronnie's instrument, which is tuned one octave lower. Since I am essentially a beginner, I cannot stretch to do some chords, so I'm wondering of going to a longer neck will be a problem. Can I just tune a mandolin down an octave?

    Don Thompson said:
    Are you asking others what instrument to play??? Sorry, your questions are so all over the place it's very difficult to answer intelligently. There are several builders on this forum that can build to your specs but YOU need to refine what you are looking for. A mandola has a 16.75" inch scale tuned CGDA a fifth lower than a mandolin. Give them more info please, we are not mind readers.

    The Octave Mandolin has a vast history and was influential in the development of the mandolin itself. Almost certainly this is a modern invention like the Irish bouzouki[citation needed]. It is based on earlier instruments but is not easily placed in the instrument family as this configuration (length and tuning) did not previously exist. The founding instrument is the mandora or mandola, which was a small lute with an almond shape. From this, an even smaller soprano version developed: the mandolino or little mandola. In this sense, an octave mandolin is a misnomer because it contradicts the sense of the mandolin being smaller but the octave being bigger. Nevertheless, many luthiers and retailers use the term as exactly equivalent to the octave mandola.

    see the confusion??????
  • Don Thompson August 10, 2010 at 10:16pm
    Are you asking others what instrument to play??? Sorry, your questions are so all over the place it's very difficult to answer intelligently. There are several builders on this forum that can build to your specs but YOU need to refine what you are looking for. A mandola has a 16.75" inch scale tuned CGDA a fifth lower than a mandolin. Give them more info please, we are not mind readers.

    The Octave Mandolin has a vast history and was influential in the development of the mandolin itself. Almost certainly this is a modern invention like the Irish bouzouki[citation needed]. It is based on earlier instruments but is not easily placed in the instrument family as this configuration (length and tuning) did not previously exist. The founding instrument is the mandora or mandola, which was a small lute with an almond shape. From this, an even smaller soprano version developed: the mandolino or little mandola. In this sense, an octave mandolin is a misnomer because it contradicts the sense of the mandolin being smaller but the octave being bigger. Nevertheless, many luthiers and retailers use the term as exactly equivalent to the octave mandola.

    see the confusion??????
This reply was deleted.