Comment

Comment by Willardj on June 22, 2010 at 1:14am

LETS BUILD and play....thanks for the group MS.DIANE....

Comment by Mark on June 22, 2010 at 12:29am

I apologise if I went too far in my remarks - unfortunately the nature of CanJoe*John's original post touched on some pet hates of mine and I allowed that to distract me from the main points. On reflection I should not have done so.

It seems to me that...

Can Joe is a trademark legitimately claimed by CanJoe*John

canjo is a generic term for banjo-related instruments that use cans or tins for a resonator (and should generally be all lower case to indicate a common noun rather than a proper noun).

Until now I've tended to use the term "tin banjo", however I can now see that canjo is quite well established as a generic name. Having done a bit of Googling, I've come across references to canjos as old folk instruments that have a place in a story that takes in the arrival of gourd-based instruments from Africa, the making of primitive banjos in the Appalacian region and the evolution of modern banjos in their many forms.

I certainly prefer canjo to "tin-tar". My canjo was aimed at creating a banjo type sound and it has much more in common with banjos than it does with guitars. For example, its "soundboard" is a thin circular membrane supported only at the periphery (albeit a tin membrane rather than a skin). I also tend to use banjo tunings.

Comment by Rand Moore on June 21, 2010 at 4:24pm

For now, let's *NOT* shut it down. This whole issue may blow over in a few days and we all can get on with more informative / constructive posts.

Comment by Diane in Chicago on June 21, 2010 at 3:53pm

Should we just shut this whole thing down and start again? Or not?

I'm here because I like to build quirky instruments, and I like to see how other people build them, too. I'm ready to share my mistakes and successes, and hopefully shorten someone else's learning curve. And I'm really gratified when someone does the same.

But arguing about proprietary rights over instruments made with cans and sticks is a big fat bore.

Comment by Rand Moore on June 21, 2010 at 3:42pm

P.S. If you all start claiming your own brand names in my absence, I have first dibs on "candidlyjo".

Comment by Rand Moore on June 21, 2010 at 3:36pm

I never meant to open such a 'can of worms' when I proposed setting up a canjo group on Cigar Box Nation. I am a novice instrument making hobbyist and a part time English teacher in China who plans to use the instruments in an introductory music/English class. So, as an individual maker, I doubt I represent any significant competition to any well established instrument maker, even the CanJoe company. However, if you take all the hobbyist and professional instrument builders on Cigar Box Nation and turn them into canjo makers, I can see where CanJoe John would be fearing for his livelihood. However, I don't think that most people already making cigar box guitars are that much interested in canjos. As a hobbyist, I see canjo making as a first step down a long road toward becoming a luthier, and maybe then some of you luthiers out there might see me as competition, but that's probably years away from now. Along that road, I see myself perfecting canjos, then adding strings to make stick dulcimers like the McNally Strumstick, then maybe mountain dulcimers, and ultimately, ukuleles. Ukuleles are, in fact, my favored string instrument. I doubt I'll have any interest in making a six string guitar, but maybe a six string stick dulcimer with three double string courses. But who knows what I'd like to do after a few years time. I suspect most canjo builders on Cigar Box Nation are like me and have an interest in making numerous different types of instruments, but only a passing interest in making canjos. I am only doing canjos because I lack wood-working skills. But after I develop more sophistication in wood working, I get into cigar box instruments, then into making my own wooden "box" resonators, using other people's creations as guides to my own designs.

Well, I'll be off line for a while traveling. Hope to be back in a few days time to continue these discussions. It's summer break for those of use who teach...

-RM

Comment by CanJoe*John on June 21, 2010 at 1:41pm

I "actually" look forward to the new creations and various new designs from this forum...lol! Call your instruments anything you like but even Herschel Brown recognized he needed an exclusive label to differentiate his own similar instruments by using a different label, calling his the "Carolina Canjoe" to identify them as such, and so as not to confuse the market with the ones I make and sell. If you read my long post, it was mostly concerning their history and was not about slinging any elbows over rights. It is simply about the request that when others making and distributing these things that their own creations be identified in some way exclusively different than the ones I produce, eg, here are examples "JoeBlows" canjo instruments, or "The One Stringer" canjo instrument, or "Hillbilly Company" canjo instrument; not labeled just as simply "The Canjo", or "The Can-jo", (or any similar spelling as these labels do not separately and distinctly identify to the public any difference). The label (name) that identifies my product is "The CanJoe" and is the established trademark identifying the CanJoe Company products. Any similar use or variation of that identifying name is misleading. Other versions should be identified by their makers that differentiate their product identity so as to prevent the public confusion about who's product they have or are purchasing. How is any of this so difficult to understand? I'm not trying to be unjustly territorial, just reasonable about the right to keep my established products easily identifiable on the market. Soft drink companies that sell cola drinks are not simply labeled by their makers as "The Cola" or the "Co-la", some are "Coca-Cola", and some are called "Pepsi Cola" so you, the consumers, know the difference, but they are all "colas"..

Comment by Rev. Nix on June 21, 2010 at 12:17pm

So can i call it a Canjo..... Canjoe* Thats all i wanna know? If i told someone its a string bean strum stick they will never learn about the history right? Cause they would google "string bean strum stick" and get all kinds of strange thing. LOL

Comment by Joker on June 21, 2010 at 12:08pm

I did not mean for my post to be an attack of any kind. I cannot speak for Mark's intentions, just my own. I just think most folks will want to use this forum to learn building techniques and share their creations. Knowing Diane in Chicago from the yahoo builders forum I am sure that was why she created it. Not to try to flood the market with canjos.

Comment by CanJoe*John on June 21, 2010 at 11:58am

First, I do sincerely apologize for the length of my previous post. There was a lot on my mind that I felt needed to be expressed concerning the documented history of the name origin and instrument design, only for the purpose of requesting fair consideration. I realized from the onset that my post would be attacked as does any thing expressed that may touch sentiments but I did not expect it to be criticized on the merits of my grammar or word choices (other than the use of lots of them). I "actually" only counted the use of the word, "actual", to be applied only once in my entire posting so to be attacked for it as if used with unstinted "superflous" repetition makes me wonder. Is the purpose to criticize for constructive reasons or just to dig? Was the content theme "actually" read and sincerely considered or is the need to rapaciously criticize so compelling? My posting information was only related to the use of cans on stringed musical instruments that have ever been introduced into the commercial marketplace as legally licensed items, no claims of any ownership to other use was otherwise made. I pledge to keep any future long winded comments to be posted only on my profile blog site from now on and, again, please pardon my earnest passion for using this forum in speaking out so capaciously about my onerous financial and personal encounters and necessities enveloping the merits of my investments and corporeal interests for my craft and livelihood.

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