Hi everyone. I've been lurking on the site for a few weeks now, and I'd like to take a moment to thank everyone for the information and pictures they've posted. There's a wealth of information here, and it's great!
I have a question. I'm gathering the parts for my first CBG project and I'm curious about two things. First, frets. I know you can buy fret wire, but I've also seen people use finishing nails, wire, and bamboo skewers. How do you go about attaching these things? Is wood glue or 5 minute epoxy enough to hold them? Am I overestimating the amount of force required to break those adhesives?
Second question: in attaching the neck to the box, I've seen people use different types of hardware and reinforcements inside the box. I want to make a resonator model, so my neck needs to be shorter, maybe only going 1/4 to a 1/3 into the box. What types of tension should I be considering here?
Any help/comments would be appreciated, and apologies if this information is in the forums and I missed it.
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Jason, I too am an apartment dweller with a pretty low level of attention. I've found that doing something else (watching TV or something) helps a bit. I do a fair amount of work outside on my patio (very small area) just for dust reasons. Unfortunately that limits me to good weather for building. My first build was done with a "Four-in-Hand" file, a sanding block, a hand saw, a dremel and a drill. I've been a little disappointed with my dremel options and tend to use it as a high-speed sander. Instead of its routing options. I have since added a hand plane, a new drill (the last one crapped out on me), a set of six hole saws that attatch to a drill, a sanding drum that attatches to a drill, and just purchased a jig-saw on an impulse buy. It was a factory refurbished tool and got it for $25. I would love to have a circular power saw with a mitre box and also a drill press but I think at that point my girlfriend would probably kick me out and I can't imagine building guitars in a car is any more efficient. Anyway, I think that using a hand plane and going a bit squarer on the neck than you were probably planning will help you with your patience issues. Watch out though...you might just get addicted and then who cares about patience. I'm a music teacher and have been known to bring a neck or a box to school with me and work on my lunch break!
Wow. I learn something new every time I come here. thanks for the laminating idea, Ben.
Jason--
Welcome!
I mostly do through-neck designs, three-stringers, so re-enforcing isn't much of an issue. I have built two resonators--one with a paint-can lid, the other with a "hand-spun" aluminum potlid. The paint-can lid was dead simple, b/c the lid just sits in the thickness of the box-top; you can use a through-neck design without much hassle. With the pot lid I had to do more head-scratching. Here's a pic:
It's a 4 string model, and I was worried about the neck joint flexing, so I secured it with wood-screws *and* epoxy. The joint seems pretty solid--the problem is in the attachment points themselves. You've got to be sure that the block (on the inside of the box) you're attaching the neck to is dead level, or you end up with a cockeyed neck. I didn't pay enough attention to that. Even a difference of a tiny bit will be noticeable.
For frets I've used both toothpicks and brass wire. The toothpicks I secured with plain old wood glue. I sawed shallow grooves for them to rest in, added a small bead of glue in each groove, then laid the toothpicks in and put a plank over the top while it set up. With the brass wire I used a water-based craft adhesive I happened to have in my junk-drawer. It worked fine.
I make the top plank shorter so that the headstock is only 2 planks thick.
Ben, thanks for this. That's a great idea, and one I hadn't thought of. Your point about tools is one half of my problem. I live in an apartment, and have never owned a home. I've not accumulated a workspace or the types of tools that I see a lot of the other guys using in their builds. I don't have a drill press, I don't have a set of fancy chisels, etc. Could you list off the types of hand tools (besides pocket knife and files as listed in the plans) that you find helpful in making your guitars? I have a dremel, but I don't have a lot of accessories, so I may need to look for those.
The second half of my problem is patience. I expected to rip that neck down to where I wanted with a couple of quick rubs of some sandpaper. I think my biggest issue here is to rethink this from an afternoon project on the weekend to a project that I take the time to do right and put some effort into. You know, kids these days... Our ADD keeps us from really taking our time and enjoying hard work done right...
Hey Jason, necks have been a sticking point for me in the world of CBG building. I lack the band saws, sanding belts, etc. that other people seem to use to shape their necks and was spending a ton of time and energy on pretty rough looking necks. I forget who I first got the idea from on here but now my necks are made out of three 1/4" thick planks that are glued together. When they're glued like this, they are extremely strong! I make the top plank shorter so that the headstock is only 2 planks thick. As for shaping the back, I use a hand held planing tool and work it that way. It still takes some time but not nearly as much as a rasp like I was doing before. I finish it all off with a sanding block and it turns out pretty nice! My necks tend to have more of a square shape with rounded edges, rather than that perfect "C" you often see on guitars. I've found that I actually prefer it. Hope some of this helps.
Thanks so much for the replies everyone. This is some great information. I'll have to pick up some finishing brads for the frets, as I really like the idea of how they'd look.
I started working on the neck tonight, and made a quick post on my page about it. The bottom line is that I had no idea how hard poplar is and I have no idea how to work it.
I've been using an old standard epoxy, JB Weld to do frets. Superglue has problems at times with metal; seems like a strong bond when the glue is still setting, but when it's quite dry it sometimes just pops off....
On my page, you can see how I put together my resonator guitar; I used a construction pretty much like a standard acoustic guitar with slots cut into the neck and the "rails" that hold the resonator forming part of the reinforcement.
Welcome Jason!
Ok, firstly, Superglue is your friend - and is amply strong enough to glue your 'frets' on. If using something round like skewers, I find it helps to cut a groove in the fretboard first to locate them - otherwise you may end up with wonky frets!
As for the reso, I aint never built a proper one, but lots of guys here have and will happily share their knowledge. Me, I would try and get as much neck as possible inside the box to give a good anchor...
Welcome aboard Jason. I am also trying to build a resonator. I have never built a guitar before, so this is going to be A challenge for me. I have been ordering some pieces for the final project. I have some pictures of my case and neck but my main concern is the soundwell. I want to make sure I get it right. I have studied a lot of pictures here and I have still decided to buy a real cone. While I am waiting for all this I have scraped together a few items I might try and build another reso from just to practice. Again, the soundwell being a problem.
Anyway as far as the neck is concerned and tension, I would probably make sure you have some real nice bracing and check out other designs here to help you. I would probably try lighter than reso gauge strings first as well.
Like I said though I am new to this. But I would like to follow your reso build and I will keep posting my build for anyone to see.
Hey Jason, Welcome to the group. Hopefully I can provide some insight. I use #16 or #17 finishing brads that I cut the head off of. I think I use the 1 1/2" ones and they are the perfect length for a use on a 1x2 neck. I mark out the frets according to the fret calculator on stewmac.com (make sure your scale length is set first). I then use a mitre box and hand saw to make cuts for the frets that are just deep enough for the brads to rest comfortably in them. After that's all set, I just pick them up and put a line of high quality super glue gel in the cut and lay the brad back on top. I usually use a pencil or something to give some pressure for a few seconds. Usually I let this sit overnight and then file the edges the following day.
As for the neck, I've started using a bolt on style that might work well with a resonator although I haven't done it yet. I have the neck end where it will meet the box. I then use high quality wood glue to secure a block of wood under it at the end to make an "L" shape. I then use another block on the inside and use wood screws to go through the blocks and box. It all sets up very strong. I've used this method for a tenor guitar and bass.
Replies
Sorry.
Jason--
Welcome!
I mostly do through-neck designs, three-stringers, so re-enforcing isn't much of an issue. I have built two resonators--one with a paint-can lid, the other with a "hand-spun" aluminum potlid. The paint-can lid was dead simple, b/c the lid just sits in the thickness of the box-top; you can use a through-neck design without much hassle. With the pot lid I had to do more head-scratching. Here's a pic:
It's a 4 string model, and I was worried about the neck joint flexing, so I secured it with wood-screws *and* epoxy. The joint seems pretty solid--the problem is in the attachment points themselves. You've got to be sure that the block (on the inside of the box) you're attaching the neck to is dead level, or you end up with a cockeyed neck. I didn't pay enough attention to that. Even a difference of a tiny bit will be noticeable.For frets I've used both toothpicks and brass wire. The toothpicks I secured with plain old wood glue. I sawed shallow grooves for them to rest in, added a small bead of glue in each groove, then laid the toothpicks in and put a plank over the top while it set up. With the brass wire I used a water-based craft adhesive I happened to have in my junk-drawer. It worked fine.
Have fun!
Ben, thanks for this. That's a great idea, and one I hadn't thought of. Your point about tools is one half of my problem. I live in an apartment, and have never owned a home. I've not accumulated a workspace or the types of tools that I see a lot of the other guys using in their builds. I don't have a drill press, I don't have a set of fancy chisels, etc. Could you list off the types of hand tools (besides pocket knife and files as listed in the plans) that you find helpful in making your guitars? I have a dremel, but I don't have a lot of accessories, so I may need to look for those.
The second half of my problem is patience. I expected to rip that neck down to where I wanted with a couple of quick rubs of some sandpaper. I think my biggest issue here is to rethink this from an afternoon project on the weekend to a project that I take the time to do right and put some effort into. You know, kids these days... Our ADD keeps us from really taking our time and enjoying hard work done right...
I started working on the neck tonight, and made a quick post on my page about it. The bottom line is that I had no idea how hard poplar is and I have no idea how to work it.
On my page, you can see how I put together my resonator guitar; I used a construction pretty much like a standard acoustic guitar with slots cut into the neck and the "rails" that hold the resonator forming part of the reinforcement.
Ok, firstly, Superglue is your friend - and is amply strong enough to glue your 'frets' on. If using something round like skewers, I find it helps to cut a groove in the fretboard first to locate them - otherwise you may end up with wonky frets!
As for the reso, I aint never built a proper one, but lots of guys here have and will happily share their knowledge. Me, I would try and get as much neck as possible inside the box to give a good anchor...
Good luck!
Anyway as far as the neck is concerned and tension, I would probably make sure you have some real nice bracing and check out other designs here to help you. I would probably try lighter than reso gauge strings first as well.
Like I said though I am new to this. But I would like to follow your reso build and I will keep posting my build for anyone to see.
As for the neck, I've started using a bolt on style that might work well with a resonator although I haven't done it yet. I have the neck end where it will meet the box. I then use high quality wood glue to secure a block of wood under it at the end to make an "L" shape. I then use another block on the inside and use wood screws to go through the blocks and box. It all sets up very strong. I've used this method for a tenor guitar and bass.
Let me know if I wasn't clear about anything.