looking for alternate tunings- - Cigar Box Nation2024-03-28T08:44:03Zhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/forum/topics/looking-for-alternate-tunings?groupUrl=cigarboxbasses&commentId=2592684%3AComment%3A2960337&groupId=2592684%3AGroup%3A109286&feed=yes&xn_auth=noIf your tuner gives you just…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-15:2592684:Comment:29603372017-10-15T02:49:24.507ZKen Hutchinsonhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/KenHutchinson
<p>If your tuner gives you just a note name like C then you do not know the octave except by other means. If your tuner says C4 then it is giving you the octave. In this case it would middle C at 262 Hz. Some tuners give you the octave number and/or the frequency in Hz, others do not.</p>
<p>I have a six string, 30 inch scale bass with the top string tuned to B3 (247 Hz) which is just half a step below middle C. I am using a 0.015 plain steel string to get that pitch at that scale length. If…</p>
<p>If your tuner gives you just a note name like C then you do not know the octave except by other means. If your tuner says C4 then it is giving you the octave. In this case it would middle C at 262 Hz. Some tuners give you the octave number and/or the frequency in Hz, others do not.</p>
<p>I have a six string, 30 inch scale bass with the top string tuned to B3 (247 Hz) which is just half a step below middle C. I am using a 0.015 plain steel string to get that pitch at that scale length. If you are trying to get much above that you may not be able to find a string with a small enough gauge. If you try to tune an A string from a normal guitar string set to the same pitch on a 30 inch scale it is possible that you will snap it because you should use a lighter gauge string to keep the tension within sane limits. The tuning pitch, scale length, and tension of a string are all related by a fairly simple formula. If you raise the pitch or increase the scale length or increase the string gauge without changing the other two then the tension will increase. So you should use lighter gauge strings on a 30 inch scale instrument than you would on a 25.5 in scale which I believe is the Fender standard scale for six string guitars.</p>
<p>Do a search on Kalium strings and you will find a string tension calculator on their website. Set the scale length to 25.5 and you will see the tensions that you get from the string gauges you normally use for a guitar. Now set the scale length to 30 inches and you will see the gauges you need to use to get the same tension at the pitches you want to use at the longer scale. The exact results vary from string brand to string brand and for differing types of strings within a brand but this would give you a ballpark number on the string gauges to use.</p>
<p>My guess is that you are trying to use too heavy a gauge of string for a 30 inch scale.</p> hi Ken,
the system will not l…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-13:2592684:Comment:29593912017-10-13T22:29:33.878ZDaniel Walterhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/DanielWalter
<p>hi Ken,</p>
<p>the system will not let me reply to you're last message, tuesday.</p>
<p>i suppose my major dilemma is when on an uneven scale, say 30, the strings will not come to pitch</p>
<p>in a normal setting. let's say that the high "A" is getting so tight that you get your safety glasses on.</p>
<p>so i'm thinking that with a strange scale length, one has to compromise.</p>
<p>also to really be ignorant, are you saying that the number on the tuner is telling you the octave?</p>
<p>oh,…</p>
<p>hi Ken,</p>
<p>the system will not let me reply to you're last message, tuesday.</p>
<p>i suppose my major dilemma is when on an uneven scale, say 30, the strings will not come to pitch</p>
<p>in a normal setting. let's say that the high "A" is getting so tight that you get your safety glasses on.</p>
<p>so i'm thinking that with a strange scale length, one has to compromise.</p>
<p>also to really be ignorant, are you saying that the number on the tuner is telling you the octave?</p>
<p>oh, i do have perfect pitch. just trying to figure out how these tuners work.</p>
<p>thank you again.</p>
<p></p>
<p></p> I'm an electrical engineer so…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-10:2592684:Comment:29571312017-10-10T16:26:42.505ZKen Hutchinsonhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/KenHutchinson
<p>I'm an electrical engineer so I know a lot more physics theory than music theory! My procedure is pretty much what you describe. Put the string on and tighten it until it is ringing cleanly, not flopping against the fingerboard. Now look at the tuner and tune it up until it is at the target note. Some tuners may tell you the octave number but most do not. So you just verify that you are in the right octave by the string tension, unless you have perfect pitch. If it seems very loose you may…</p>
<p>I'm an electrical engineer so I know a lot more physics theory than music theory! My procedure is pretty much what you describe. Put the string on and tighten it until it is ringing cleanly, not flopping against the fingerboard. Now look at the tuner and tune it up until it is at the target note. Some tuners may tell you the octave number but most do not. So you just verify that you are in the right octave by the string tension, unless you have perfect pitch. If it seems very loose you may be an octave below, if it seems very tight you may be an octave above but in many cases the string will break if you try to up tune it by an octave. Or you can compare the pitch to a keyboard instrument if you have one. The bottom three notes on an 88 key piano are A0, Bb0, and B0. The left most C on a piano is C1 and you can work up from there increasing the octave number each time you get to the next C.</p> Ken, i think it would take ma…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-09:2592684:Comment:29566402017-10-09T23:41:28.021ZDaniel Walterhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/DanielWalter
<p>Ken, i think it would take many weeks in your living room to properly understand your knowledge and music theory. so that brings up my second, and i hope, relevant question. i played piano for many years, learning and playing some classics. however i had a guy come and tune my piano. very impressive, especially when they use 5 or 6 finger chords. so, i have several guitar tuners, except a strobe. plug in, plug in and go back out, and clip ons. well, they usually try to find your note. so set…</p>
<p>Ken, i think it would take many weeks in your living room to properly understand your knowledge and music theory. so that brings up my second, and i hope, relevant question. i played piano for many years, learning and playing some classics. however i had a guy come and tune my piano. very impressive, especially when they use 5 or 6 finger chords. so, i have several guitar tuners, except a strobe. plug in, plug in and go back out, and clip ons. well, they usually try to find your note. so set it to bass, it'll try to find your note, E4, etc. so with unconventional instruments not always the case. my method is to start with the biggest string and tune till it's not flopping around. sometimes to get the right note, the string seems way too tight, like it's an octave above? i don't want my strings buzzing, but i also don't need a distressed string. also, i use the standard 440hz, is this also something i should explore?</p>
<p></p> It gets confusing because the…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-09:2592684:Comment:29565312017-10-09T21:23:48.412ZKen Hutchinsonhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/KenHutchinson
<p>It gets confusing because there are not two but many E's and the same for every other note. Scientists (and bassists) generally designate notes by frequency or by the note letter followed by a number. Normal guitars are tuned starting on E2 (82 Hz) and ending on E4 (330 Hz). Basses are normally tuned starting on E1 (41 Hz). If by CGD you mean that you will tune C2 (65Hz), G2 (98Hz), and D3 (147Hz) then I think that is feasible. If you meant you want to tune an octave above that then yes that…</p>
<p>It gets confusing because there are not two but many E's and the same for every other note. Scientists (and bassists) generally designate notes by frequency or by the note letter followed by a number. Normal guitars are tuned starting on E2 (82 Hz) and ending on E4 (330 Hz). Basses are normally tuned starting on E1 (41 Hz). If by CGD you mean that you will tune C2 (65Hz), G2 (98Hz), and D3 (147Hz) then I think that is feasible. If you meant you want to tune an octave above that then yes that is well within the normal range of guitar tunings at a 25 inch scale.</p> well, rust never sleeps, and…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-09:2592684:Comment:29563732017-10-09T17:50:54.750ZDaniel Walterhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/DanielWalter
<p>well, rust never sleeps, and i'm a bit rusty on the cello.</p>
<p>so you lost me with the between the "E". normal bass is EADG, so</p>
<p>there is no second E.</p>
<p>so with 3 strings, can i use CGD ?…</p>
<p></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306638951?profile=original" target="_self"><img class="align-full" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306638951?profile=original" width="240"></img></a> <a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306640157?profile=original" target="_self"><img class="align-full" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306640157?profile=original" width="623"></img></a></p>
<p>well, rust never sleeps, and i'm a bit rusty on the cello.</p>
<p>so you lost me with the between the "E". normal bass is EADG, so</p>
<p>there is no second E.</p>
<p>so with 3 strings, can i use CGD ?</p>
<p></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306638951?profile=original" target="_self"><img src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306638951?profile=original" class="align-full" width="240"></a><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306640157?profile=original" target="_self"><img src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/306640157?profile=original" class="align-full" width="623"></a></p> Poking around a little on Tal…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-09:2592684:Comment:29563282017-10-09T12:38:17.149ZKen Hutchinsonhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/KenHutchinson
<p>Poking around a little on Talkbass.com I could not find a lot of information on 25.5 inch guitar to bass conversion tunings but I think that some go as low as the traditional EADG bass tuning. In fact I once read somewhere that some guitarists drop tune by a whole octave and so they start on the bass guitar's low E. Eastwood guitars makes a lot of quirky instruments and they have a four string "Warren Ellis Tenor Baritone" model with a 26 inch scale and tuned CGDA starting on the C between…</p>
<p>Poking around a little on Talkbass.com I could not find a lot of information on 25.5 inch guitar to bass conversion tunings but I think that some go as low as the traditional EADG bass tuning. In fact I once read somewhere that some guitarists drop tune by a whole octave and so they start on the bass guitar's low E. Eastwood guitars makes a lot of quirky instruments and they have a four string "Warren Ellis Tenor Baritone" model with a 26 inch scale and tuned CGDA starting on the C between the bass guitar E and the normal guitar E. In other words to exactly the same pitches as a cello.</p> wow, thank you ! finally !tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-08:2592684:Comment:29558242017-10-08T14:43:02.866ZDaniel Walterhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/DanielWalter
<p>wow, thank you ! finally !</p>
<p>wow, thank you ! finally !</p> At such a short scale GDA sho…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-08:2592684:Comment:29557132017-10-08T03:06:25.296ZKen Hutchinsonhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/KenHutchinson
<p>At such a short scale GDA should work better than EAD and from what I gather a fifths tuning is not uncommon in the cigar box universe. My kit instructions advised tuning in fifths and of course I followed that advice. In the end it depends on your friend's choice. Many bassists who try to switch from fourths to fifths run screaming back to the tuning they know after a very short trial period. Some stick it out and find they love it. A few are like me and love it instantly. And then there…</p>
<p>At such a short scale GDA should work better than EAD and from what I gather a fifths tuning is not uncommon in the cigar box universe. My kit instructions advised tuning in fifths and of course I followed that advice. In the end it depends on your friend's choice. Many bassists who try to switch from fourths to fifths run screaming back to the tuning they know after a very short trial period. Some stick it out and find they love it. A few are like me and love it instantly. And then there are the cellists who decide to try to play bass guitar. As one might expect they tend to love the fifths tuning.</p>
<p>There are bassists who convert conventional 25.5 inch guitars to basses. I cannot recall offhand what tuning they typically use.</p> thank you! my scale is actual…tag:www.cigarboxnation.com,2017-10-07:2592684:Comment:29552282017-10-07T13:47:28.391ZDaniel Walterhttps://www.cigarboxnation.com/profile/DanielWalter
<p>thank you! my scale is actually shorter than 30'', around 25, but still sounds awesome. will GDA</p>
<p>work for that scale length. at the moment it's EAD, but my friend likes to find his own tuning?</p>
<p>thank you! my scale is actually shorter than 30'', around 25, but still sounds awesome. will GDA</p>
<p>work for that scale length. at the moment it's EAD, but my friend likes to find his own tuning?</p>