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Need help with some tuning issues

Hey all,

With my last two builds (numbers 3 and 4 for me) the low G string sounds funky. It's in tune at open and at the 12th fret, but in between, it's off, especially at the first few frets.

The D and high G strings are fine up and down the neck!

I use a jumbo (zero) fret at the nut, and my frets overall seem to be level when I check them with a rocker.

They both have recessed headstocks with a retainer bar. I am wondering if the retainer is not set low enough, because the string angle between the tuners and the zero fret is pretty moderate, as you can see in the attached pic.

Can this affect the notes up and down the neck?

I hate to make more guitars without knowing what I am doing that is causing this.

I can't tell you how much I appreciate all the knowledge on this site and in this community!

Dave

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Permalink Reply by BrianQ. on October 23, 2020 at 7:58am

Angle of deflection is good in the pic, can you show a pic of the overall setup, as to see the placement of the bridge?

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Permalink Reply by Korrigan on October 23, 2020 at 1:30pm

I'm with Brian, I suspect the bridge might not be set correctly.

The bass string side of the bridge should be farther from the nut than the treble side.
saddle angle and compensation

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Permalink Reply by Taffy Evans on October 23, 2020 at 12:17pm

Hi Dave, its difficult to say what the issue is with your guitar when not being able to inspect it, but here are some points to check, going from my past experience.

* the string could be faulty. I 've had customers change a string and fixed the same
problem.
* String too high at the nut. Stretching out of tune. Zero fret not fully seated.
* Fret spacing slightly off.
* Frets have flat tops [no crown] so scale length could be off the front or the back of the fret. Same for the Zero fret.

I would also check other frets, as you do the 12th, for correct pitch [or close to it] using digital tuner.
Let us know what you find, it may help others in the future.
Taff

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Permalink Reply by Taffy Evans on October 23, 2020 at 8:13pm

Yes that could be the problem. But I was working on the fact that the intonation was correct at the twelfth fret and the problem was at the nut end. Bridge compensation usually aids in better intonation as you play up the neck, due to extra string height, and so streatching sharp. Interesting, but I would also check as you guys suggest.
Taff

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Permalink Reply by Dave Roy on October 24, 2020 at 5:30am

IMG-5316.JPG

IMG-5318.jpg

IMG-5319.jpg

I attached three pics - full shot of both guitars, and close-ups of each of their bridges.

I just got a Snark this AM and intonated them again. Definite improvement (I was using an app on my phone), (30 years ago I played bass in a reggae band, and my bandmates thought it was hilarious that I couldn't tune by ear...guess I still can't).

Still a little off up the neck in places, but much better.

To Taffy's points:

I did realize that the zero fret on the undercrown box is a hair high on the low G string side.

I also didn't spend much time crowning the frets, so that may contribute too.

I certainly did my best to keep the frets on point when using the template and cutting them, but that is a possibility too...

I really appreciate your help and welcome any more suggestions.